RTHK Hong Kong Museum of Lifestyles Hong Kong Experts Interview Series 2 Transcript (05/05/2026)

I recently received an invitation to be interviewed on RTHK Radio 1's "Hong Kong Living Museum," and the interview will be broadcast in three parts. I'm grateful to the hosts for asking such insightful questions, which led me to share many behind-the-scenes stories I've never mentioned in previous interviews or online. These include my experience working at a convenience store for my first job and the struggles I faced a few years ago after graduation when deciding between entering the legal field or pursuing Re Pillow. If you're interested, you can listen to the full episodes on the RTHK website via the links below:

https://www.rthk.hk/radio/radio1/programme/yolo/episode/1096427

https://www.rthk.hk/radio/radio1/programme/yolo/episode/1096694

https://www.rthk.hk/radio/radio1/programme/yolo/episode/1096931

I understand that sometimes it's inconvenient to listen to the show or that online links may expire after a while. Therefore, I will post the transcript of Episode 2 below:

RTHK Hong Kong Living Museum - Hong Kong Expert Interview Episode 2 Transcript (05/05/2026)

Gary Tam Wai Kuen: Hong Kong Experts. On Tuesday, our Hong Kong expert, we talked to this distant relative of Leung Lai Kan yesterday...

Leung Lai Kan: We're friends now, haha...

Gary Tam Wai Kuen: We acknowledged it, acknowledged it. We have the same name, just a slight difference. And half of our ancestral origins are the same too.

Leung Lai Kan: I'm actually very happy because he's excellent at his studies, so I feel honored.

Gary Tam Wai Kuen: To bask in a little of his glory, right? Today we have our bedding expert, Ryan Leung Lai Hang.

Leung Lai Kan: Hello, Ryan. Yesterday we talked about how Ryan studied law, but in the end, he didn't choose to become a lawyer and instead went into bedding. Your family is also involved in this industry, aren't they?

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: Yes. Around 1945, my grandfather started selling charcoal and cotton quilts in Sham Shui Po, Cheung Sha Wan. Later, when Hong Kong stopped using charcoal, he started making cotton quilts. Back then, it was a shop with living quarters behind it. He would sew quilts and pillows in the back, fill them, and hang them at the entrance to sell.

Gary Tam Wai Kuen: Because when I was little, I also used cotton quilts. Cotton quilts were measured by jin (weight) for size, and they felt very heavy to sleep under. I also didn't know how to "beat" them – back then you really did beat them, not in the sense of being hit, but actually beating the cotton quilts. Is that right? How do you beat them?

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: In the past, cotton quilts were sold by different weights. Since I didn't experience that era myself... (Kuen: I only heard about it too). (Yuen: I know, I know, I saw it in documentaries). Each cotton quilt had a different weight. My current understanding is... it probably involved finding someone to "fluff up" the cotton. I think some elders might explain it more clearly. It was about using cotton threads to bind the fluffed cotton, then flattening the cotton into the shape of a quilt, and finally securing it with cotton threads. But because the cotton absorbs human moisture, it becomes denser over time. The actual weight doesn't change, but because it's denser and not as fluffy as before, it feels heavier. (Kan: When it gets dense, it feels less warm than before). (Kuen: I heard about silk quilts). Silk quilts have some silk added to them, which makes them a bit more expensive. Because the cotton is exposed, when you change the duvet cover or use it daily, the cotton comes out, turns into household dust, and the quilt gets thinner and thinner.

Leung Lai Kan: So, your grandfather started this business, and it just grew bigger and bigger, right?

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: To be honest, my family's business was rather ordinary; we didn't make a fortune. So, it gradually changed later on, from making and selling cotton quilts ourselves to selling them through department stores. The business model also changed significantly. At some point, my uncle thought, why don't we switch to factory production and stop retailing cotton quilts in Sham Shui Po? So, we started to transform, producing pillows and quilts for department stores, Chinese product stores, etc., allowing them to sell them under other brands.

Daniel Chan Ho Yuen: Ryan, speaking of your transition to factory production, the factory was also in Hong Kong, because at that time, manufacturing hadn't moved north yet, right?

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: That's right, the factory was in Kwai Chung back then, and we still make pillows there now. The company also has another factory in Guangdong.

Leung Lai Kan: You manufactured for Chinese product stores, or supplied different brands, and this continued until you took over, is that right?

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: Around 2000, my uncle also launched a brand. It was sold in department stores, but it was a relatively small brand.

Leung Lai Kan: So, it was your own brand?

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: Yes, we created our own brand and sold it in department stores. It's been selling from around 2000 until now.

Leung Lai Kan: Oh... I see.

Daniel Chan Ho Yuen: So you have your own brand now. Do you have a burning desire to continue the legacy, which is why you're so persistent? And you hope to keep this going, taking on this responsibility, or this industry?

 Ryan Leung Lai Hang: To be honest, I truly want to carry on this legacy. (Kan: Haha... ) (Kuen: You can take on...)

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: Because I enjoy designing products; I like coming up with solutions to problems. So, a more accurate way to put it would be that this is a platform that allows me to experiment with making products.

Daniel Chan Ho Yuen: Speaking of product design, I know that when Ryan was still in university, he designed his first product, but it was just for himself. Why did you design this first product?

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: It was around 2019, 2020, when I was still studying at university. In early 2020, the pandemic started, and we were told not to go to school. I felt that the pillows at home made me sleep poorly. My mother used to buy my pillows, and they weren't very good, so I tried to figure out how to sleep better myself. I tried sleeping with two pillows stacked together, which seemed a bit better, but still wasn't quite comfortable. Then I went to department stores to try different new pillows, because the old ones had probably been used for five or six years, so I thought I'd try changing them. But I kept buying pillows until my entire windowsill was full, and I was never satisfied. I was a bit annoyed because I felt like I had spent a lot of money, right? I was still a student, and pillows aren't cheap, so I decided to just take them apart and see what was inside. One or two of the memory foam pillows were pretty good, but there was one spot that was "pushing against me." I cut open the fabric cover, disassembled it, and inside was foam. Then I used a utility knife to shave it down, according to the shape of my head. I felt that a certain spot was pushing against me, so I shaved it off. I kept trying this repeatedly. Maybe I'd shave off a bit in one spot tonight, and it would be slightly worse, so I'd shave it again tomorrow. If I shaved too much, I'd stick a bit back on. (Everyone: Haha...) I really did that; you wouldn't buy a new one. Some pillows are fillable, so I thought, why not stack two together? Or mix them up in various ways? Then I thought, why don't I make a personal pillow that can be adjusted to the individual, because everyone's height, weight, neck length, and shoulder width are actually different.

Leung Lai Kan: And head size too.

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: Yes. Head size, weight, all different. Why do advertisements seem to claim that one pillow fits everyone perfectly? Why is this shape so ergonomic? Why isn't it that different people should use different pillows? So I thought, why not make an adjustable pillow, and this adjustment wouldn't be done in a department store, trying it for maybe three or five minutes. Because honestly, trying it that way isn't very accurate. You might feel good at that moment, feel okay a few days after taking it home, but then after two weeks, you might feel it's completely unsuitable. What then? So I thought, what if the pillow's height could be adjusted? If I want it higher, I can make it higher. If I want it lower, I can make it lower. So that's how I made my first pillow.

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Ryan Leung Lai Hang: Actually, the concept is very simple, like a regular cotton-filled pillow. But the filling was a specific ratio that I came up with after constantly mixing and trying different materials. The effect was soft but also supportive, because often cotton pillows are too flat (Kan: Yes! Yes!) and don't provide enough support. The materials each need to have a specific ratio. The concept is very simple: there's a zipper on the side of the pillow; you open it and can remove the cotton. If it feels too low, you can add more filling, it's that simple. Also, the pillow surface is a bit different; the fabric has a waterproof and stain-resistant treatment. Because I noticed that when I changed pillowcases, the originally white pillowcases easily turned yellow. (Kan: Yes! Yes!) I realized it was my sweat stains. How could I solve that? Actually, some of our sportswear can be waterproof and stain-resistant, so why not use those materials on pillows? So I did that. I was actually very foolish at the beginning because I spent a lot of money ordering these materials from the US. I made one for myself, or a few more for friends. I didn't even use up all the materials, but that's how I made the first pillow.

Gary Tam Wai Kuen: And then? After you made it, did you really sleep much more comfortably that night? (Kan: Because you were so tired after making it, haha...) (Yuen: Did you even fall asleep? Haha...)

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: Actually, there wasn't a... there wasn't a specific day when I finished it. Because the pillow was constantly being modified. This isn't good, that isn't good, it doesn't seem quite right, I'll try again tomorrow, like that... And it took about nine months to modify it until I had a pillow that worked for me.

Leung Lai Kan: But, was there really a moment when it was completely... wow! So comfortable? Did that moment really happen?

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: Actually, there was never a "it's perfect" moment. Because even after trying it and it seems okay now, I'll still keep trying. (Kan: So, it's a gradual process...)

Gary Tam Wai Kuen: Or your friends, when you made them for your friends, after they tried them, they would also tell you: "It's great! This pillow is so good!"

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: I clearly remember one time a friend of mine told me he also had this problem of uncomfortable pillows. He said, "Since you make pillows, why don't you make one more? You're already making them anyway." So I agreed to make one more for him. It turned out that he later gave the pillow to his mother. I didn't entirely trust what my friend said, because friends would definitely say, "Oh, your pillow is good." But if it was my friend's mother, or if his mother also introduced other aunts to get one, then I would believe it. When people who don't know me say the pillow is good, I started to feel like I was really doing something.

Daniel Chan Ho Yuen: I want to ask Ryan, during the few months you were creating your first pillow, you're from a bedding family. Did your father or your family just watch coldly as you kept taking apart and sewing pillows, telling you to stop messing around? How did they view what you were doing?

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: They wouldn't mind if I did it, but there were two things. First, on the factory side, they had to calculate the costs for me. That means rent, salaries, and materials all had to be accounted for in terms of money. I think this is very important, because if they supported me unconditionally, I wouldn't learn how to calculate, and I would become a spoiled rich kid, which is very important. The second thing is that my family at the time felt that whatever I did was fine, but I had to continue my studies and maintain my grades. When I heard that, I was a bit rebellious and felt like they didn't understand me. But actually, they were right. Because what you're doing isn't necessarily going to be successful; there's a 90% chance it might fail. If you do something like this, and then your studies also suffer, and you can't graduate, what then? What's your backup plan? So first, calculate the costs well. Second, studying is the priority.

Leung Lai Kan: So you put the money you earned from the convenience store into it, is that right?

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: Because I studied computer science in secondary school, and some of my friends didn't know how to create websites. Back then, making websites wasn't as convenient as it is now, so I would help them make websites and earn some pocket money.

Leung Lai Kan: That's actually quite good. You want to achieve a goal, and then you use other skills to find some capital for it, and then put it back into your own dream. I think that's very meaningful.

Daniel Chan Ho Yuen: And your family is really good; they don't spoil you. They calculate every dollar and cent with you, because when you go out and do business in the future, no one will not calculate with you; they'll count every penny. So I think this is very educational.

Gary Tam Wai Kuen: And secretly, they were actually very supportive of him.

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: I remember back then, I had to go to school from Monday to Friday. On Saturdays, no one was working in the industrial building, so I would go there myself to make my pillows. I still remember there was a post office opposite the company, so I would go to the post office myself to mail pillows to customers, or meet customers at the MTR station for delivery.

Leung Lai Kan: Oh! This is very interesting! Very interesting!

Gary Tam Wai Kuen: Do you still remember the feedback from your first customer? When you genuinely made a successful sale.

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: I don't really remember the very first customer, but I vividly remember one customer, I think she was one of the first few dozen customers, not yet a hundred. She praised it immensely, because she said she had tried many pillows and none worked. This pillow was great; she wrote me a very long feedback. She said this pillow really helped a lot; she used to have some bronchial problems. Actually, her bronchial problems were because the height of her pillow was incorrect, leading to suffocating in her sleep, inability to breathe, and nightmares. Perhaps if she had bought another pillow, as long as the height was right, it would have been fine.

Leung Lai Kan: It would have been resolved.

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: Exactly. But unfortunately, it's quite difficult to find the most suitable pillow by trying them out for a few minutes in a department store. So, through my pillow, she adjusted the height and solved the problem that many other pillows couldn't fix.

Daniel Chan Ho Yuen: Ryan, you've now accumulated a larger customer database. You have many different clients. What do they most often tell you are the negative physical conditions they experience if a pillow isn't right? For example, we can imagine not sleeping well, headaches, or nightmares. Are there any other strange or difficult conditions that we might not know about?

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: "Wry neck" is the most common.

Leung Lai Kan: Oh...

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: "Wry neck" is definitely the most common, usually due to incorrect pillow height. The second most common is snoring, especially among men. This can also be resolved by adjusting the pillow height.

Leung Lai Kan: Initially, you must have been serving people you knew, and then you found that the feedback was quite good. Did you then start to expand your business concept?

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: Because I was helping others create websites at the time, I thought, why don't I create a website for myself? To sell my own products on the website. Because my friends, classmates, they all gave my phone number to their aunts, and then to others, and it's not good for too many people to know your phone number.

Leung Lai Kan: Exactly, that's also a problem.

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: Anyway, since I was already making websites for others, I might as well make one for myself so people could place orders independently, with some product introductions. Customers could handle it themselves, so not everyone needed to WhatsApp to inquire and order. Because of this, when friends introduced friends, some small online stores saw my website. They thought it was pretty good and then listed my products on their online stores. This online store is no longer around, but they did help me promote it at the time, allowing more people to learn about my products. I think I did this for about a year and a half, and the business stabilized, because I was studying at the time, so it was like a side job outside of my studies, earning some pocket money.

Gary Tam Wai Kuen: But throughout the entire process, what did you find to be the most difficult or trickiest part?

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: Hmm... because I was still studying at the time, I had about one or two years left until graduation. I didn't know what I should do afterward. I worked very hard, and every time a customer told me the product was great, I was happy on one hand, but on the other hand, I felt a little unsure how to tell them, how to explain to them that I might not be doing this in two years. (Kan: Oh...) The more customers told me, "Thank you so much, you must keep doing this, I'll recommend it to my friends," I would of course politely thank them. But on the other hand, I was a little worried, if I really didn't do it in two years, how would I explain it to them? Because they wouldn't know, they would just know that this shop might not be operating anymore, but I would feel like I owed someone, that...

Leung Lai Kan: Hmm... You've opened a path for me, and I'm full of joy. What if you suddenly disappear without a trace? What then? You care about these things...

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: Yes, I think this is... because graduation is something that will happen in two years, it's inevitable. (Kan: Hmm...) This is the hardest problem for me to resolve in my heart. Production, promotion, and everything else are secondary. I feel like I can't ultimately take responsibility for them, and I feel like I owe people.

Leung Lai Kan: It's rare for me to encounter a business owner who thinks so deeply. Because in our daily lives, we often deal with large corporations, and you can't reach the owners of large corporations, but I've truly never encountered an owner who would think in this direction.

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: I think it's probably because I didn't start from a business perspective. I'm just an ordinary person; I also bought pillows that didn't feel right. I can't claim that my pillows are suitable for everyone. After doing this for so long, there will definitely be people who feel, "Your pillow really doesn't work, I can't use it." That's bound to happen. But I try my best to do things well and put myself in others' shoes. I remember about a year or two ago, I was in Tsim Sha Tsui, filling in for a colleague to mind the shop, and an auntie customer told me, "We don't know what will happen later if that young man says he's not doing it anymore, what then?" (Everyone: Haha...)

Daniel Chan Ho Yuen: You would say, "Auntie, I am that young man you're talking about! I promise you, I won't."

Ryan Leung Lai Hang: I wouldn't dare promise. Suppose I continue for another five or ten years, and it really doesn't work out, and I can't even make a basic income, then I might as well find an ordinary job. How can I promise? These are all invisible pressures that sometimes I think about in my head. I think the only solution is to do my best.

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